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=No, I didn’t write this … attribs were snipped incorrectly.= >>           – Not if he likes you. >>           – Only if you look at his eyes. >>               (That’s a double-whammy, because people who are >>               afraid of dogs usually stare at the dog’s eyes, >>               provoking the dog to any latent aggression the dog >>               may harbor <g>.  But saying that will make the person >>               feel s/he HAS to stare at the dog’s eyes, to know >>               whether the dog is now going to bite.) >Strange, I always thought dogs bite with the teeth, not the eyes

Alicia Knapp, The DoberGRLs, Echo and Mako and The Dog of Eternal Stench, Boomer, in Anoka, MN Home is where the dogs are.

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Rene, You are mis-attributing posts. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.breeds >> >>           – Not if he likes you. >> >>           – Only if you look at his eyes. >> >>               (That’s a double-whammy, because people who are >> >>               afraid of dogs usually stare at the dog’s eyes, >> >>               provoking the dog to any latent aggression the dog >> >>               may harbor <g>.  But saying that will make the person >> >>               feel s/he HAS to stare at the dog’s eyes, to know >> >>               whether the dog is now going to bite.)

It was I who wrote the above, not Alicia, whose posts I respect immensely.  Please be careful about your attributions.  Thank you. Sat 05-Apr-97; 11:29  – Carol, with Feline Prancy Wallbounce, and  Australian Terriers Kaliko Achilles Thunderpaws and Kwali Twinkletoes —  * RoseReader 2.52B P001545 Entered at [BB&C]

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >>           – Not if he likes you. > >>           – Only if you look at his eyes. > >>               (That’s a double-whammy, because people who are > >>               afraid of dogs usually stare at the dog’s eyes, > >>               provoking the dog to any latent aggression the dog > >>               may harbor <g>.  But saying that will make the person > >>               feel s/he HAS to stare at the dog’s eyes, to know > >>               whether the dog is now going to bite.) > Strange, I always thought dogs bite with the teeth, not the eyes > Well, now, Rene, we all know by now you’re pretty clueless in dog > behavior. Now youve proved beyond the shadow of a doubt that you should > own plush animals instead of flesh and blood ones.

Maybe I should own both,  now my dog owns the plush teddy. Poor teddy!      The dog is not stupid and moronic. He knows the teddy will not bite back.  But then, we who *do* – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> understand dog behavior know that’s it’s abusive to hold a dog up by > it’s leg dangling in the air for punishment when it bites it’s stupid > & moronic owner. > Terri

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> >>           – Not if he likes you. >>           – Only if you look at his eyes. >>               (That’s a double-whammy, because people who are >>               afraid of dogs usually stare at the dog’s eyes, >>               provoking the dog to any latent aggression the dog >>               may harbor <g>.  But saying that will make the person >>               feel s/he HAS to stare at the dog’s eyes, to know >>               whether the dog is now going to bite.) > Strange, I always thought dogs bite with the teeth, not the eyes

Well, now, Rene, we all know by now you’re pretty clueless in dog behavior. Now youve proved beyond the shadow of a doubt that you should own plush animals instead of flesh and blood ones. But then, we who *do* understand dog behavior know that’s it’s abusive to hold a dog up by it’s leg dangling in the air for punishment when it bites it’s stupid & moronic owner. Terri

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>>           – Not if he likes you. >           – Only if you look at his eyes. >               (That’s a double-whammy, because people who are >               afraid of dogs usually stare at the dog’s eyes, >               provoking the dog to any latent aggression the dog >               may harbor <g>.  But saying that will make the person >               feel s/he HAS to stare at the dog’s eyes, to know >               whether the dog is now going to bite.)

Strange, I always thought dogs bite with the teeth, not the eyes

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> : >Question: Does your dog bite? > : >Answers:

We do pet assisted therapy, and get this question a lot from fearful children and adults.  A trainer once told us never to say "NO," since any dog will bite if sufficiently provoked, and you do not want to encourage a child to pound on a dog said to be "safe." The last time this happened to me, I turned the dog (miniature poodle) so the rear, not the front, was facing the child, and said "This end doesn’t."  Big chuckle from the parents and the child got to pet a nice pompom tail and avoided licks, teeth, etc. – Lynda (& Magic & Silver, mini poos in Mpls)

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>When the delivery men came, they cast a few wary glances at the >Doberman and Rottweiller watching them, and asked nervously "Will they >bite?" >I offered my friendliest smile and answered "Not unless they need to."

Excellent warning. I’ve on occaision preceded that by "usually" if I picked up any bad vibes. Bob Maida Manassas,Va

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: >Question: Does your dog bite? : >Answers: My mother’s answer: He bites his food.

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<snip> >Question: Does your dog bite? >Answers: >Mel:       – Not that we KNOW of. >Nancy:     – Not without permission. >Carol:     – Only under command. >(launching into more fantasy): >           – Not if he likes you. >           – Only if you look at his eyes. >               (That’s a double-whammy, because people who are >               afraid of dogs usually stare at the dog’s eyes, >               provoking the dog to any latent aggression the dog >               may harbor <g>.  But saying that will make the person >               feel s/he HAS to stare at the dog’s eyes, to know >               whether the dog is now going to bite.)

Heh heh – that’s a good one. >When out with both your dogs, male and female, to get the questioner >to do contortions (mine are small dogs, with hair hanging down in >essential places) – will only work in very close quarters, where the >questioner can’t back off. >           – The male doesn’t bite. >           – The female doesn’t bite. >When the questioner’s stare has started the dog barking: >           – Not when she’s barking.  Kwali, Quiet. >escalating in close quarters: >           – Only if you turn your back. >Somebody else take it from here; this could be fun.

One day when I was still living in the city, I was expecting a delivery while my husband was at work. The purchase was from a charitable institution that employed the "down and out" to help them build work history: ex-cons, former drug addicts, the homeless, etc. With the front door propped wide open and a living room small enough to make maneuvering tight for several big guys, me, and my purchase, it seemed wise to have the dogs out from under foot. At the same time, I sure didn’t want them behind a closed door …. So I put them in the kitchen, commanded "stay" and =propped= a baby gate in the doorway. Sneeze on it and it was coming down. When the delivery men came, they cast a few wary glances at the Doberman and Rottweiller watching them, and asked nervously "Will they bite?" I offered my friendliest smile and answered "Not unless they need to." Alicia Knapp, The DoberGRLs, Echo and Mako and The Dog of Eternal Stench, Boomer, in Anoka, MN Home is where the dogs are.

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You MUST cut the Q out of ‘carolq’ in the apparent return address or your message will bounce! This is anti-spam protection. Great thoughts on these phrases <evil grin>. > Newsgroups: rec.pets.dogs.breeds > My favorite reply to does the dog bite questions is ‘not without > permission!’ makes people think twice about the level of control I have > with my animals <g> > Nancy

Ohhhhh, I love that one!  As well as Mel’s: >   My fav reply is "not that we KNOW of".  This presents the idea that the > dog may have detered an intruder while we were not home/awake.  This

Yours is more aggressive  Mel’s is quite subtly so.  I have a third one:  "Only under command." Question: Does your dog bite? Answers: Mel:       – Not that we KNOW of. Nancy:     – Not without permission. Carol:     – Only under command. (launching into more fantasy):            - Not if he likes you.            - Only if you look at his eyes.                (That’s a double-whammy, because people who are                afraid of dogs usually stare at the dog’s eyes,                provoking the dog to any latent aggression the dog                may harbor <g>.  But saying that will make the person                feel s/he HAS to stare at the dog’s eyes, to know                whether the dog is now going to bite.) When out with both your dogs, male and female, to get the questioner to do contortions (mine are small dogs, with hair hanging down in essential places) – will only work in very close quarters, where the questioner can’t back off.            - The male doesn’t bite.            - The female doesn’t bite. When the questioner’s stare has started the dog barking:            - Not when she’s barking.  Kwali, Quiet. escalating in close quarters:            - Only if you turn your back. Somebody else take it from here; this could be fun. Mon 31-Mar-97; 23:32  – Carol, with Feline Prancy Wallbounce, and  Australian Terriers Kaliko Achilles Thunderpaws and Kwali Twinkletoes —  * RoseReader 2.52B P001545 Entered at [BB&C]

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>   My fav reply is "not that we KNOW of".  This presents the idea that the > dog may have detered an intruder while we were not home/awake.  This reply > is only given to uninvited solicitors/ppl (not neighbors) met while on > walks out of our neighborhood.  Children (and adults that need it) are > told the correct way to approach a strange dog that has his person with > him, and educated not to approach a dog that is roaming and unattended. > Mel and the Zoo Crew

My reply is, "Don’t get near him.  He’ll rip your arm off.  You’ve been warned."         Steve Barnard

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My favorite reply to does the dog bite questions is ‘not without permission!’ makes people think twice about the level of control I have with my animals <g> Nancy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->   My fav reply is "not that we KNOW of".  This presents the idea that the > dog may have detered an intruder while we were not home/awake.  This reply > is only given to uninvited solicitors/ppl (not neighbors) met while on > walks out of our neighborhood.  Children (and adults that need it) are > told the correct way to approach a strange dog that has his person with > him, and educated not to approach a dog that is roaming and unattended. > Mel and the Zoo Crew

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  My fav reply is "not that we KNOW of".  This presents the idea that the dog may have detered an intruder while we were not home/awake.  This reply is only given to uninvited solicitors/ppl (not neighbors) met while on walks out of our neighborhood.  Children (and adults that need it) are told the correct way to approach a strange dog that has his person with him, and educated not to approach a dog that is roaming and unattended. Mel and the Zoo Crew

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Thanx for the info, Nancy.  Did you know that the AKC is working with the American Equine Insurance Companies to come up with an equitable insurance policy for dog owners?  Looks like it’s none too soon. You’d think that for having certain breeds (like my Doberkids) people should get a deduction for a security alarm!  Ah, heck, why just certain breeds – any dog that has a voice can be a deterrent to crime. Just something else to make life miserable for the responsible dog owner….<sigh> ****Nancy E. Phillips      Sher-El Dobermans & Greyhounds   "Spirit, Grace, Love"              Second Hand Dogs Give First Class Love – SPDR

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I use what I read some time ago, when asked if dog is safe/bites….."I don’t know.", and I don’t know!!  Keeps people at a distance most of the time. leh

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>Here is the article for you to read – I do not promote any of the stated >’facts’ as truth I am just presenting it for you to think about and see if >any one has any ideas of remedies for this kind of stuff.

Remedies? YES: 1.Properly train and socialize your dog.Most dogs involved in incidents are not properly trained or socialized. 2. Do not get a dog from pet shop or back yard breeder. Poor breeding and poor temperament go hand in hand. 3. KEEP THE DOG’S PROTECTIVE NATURE IN CHECK How??? a. Do not allow barking at animals, neighbors, animals, joggers, passerbyes and autos. Do not allow ANY barking on leash walks unless you are in immediate danger of assault. This is to be from YOUR perception, and not the dog’s. At home dog should bark ONLY in response to a door knock, buzzer, chime, etc. Or respond to an attempted INAPPROPIATE penetration of your property. This again is to be from YOUR perception and NOT that of the dog’s. b. DO NOT leave your dog out unattended or when asleep, off property, in shower, making love, hanging wallpaper or whenever in a position where the barking cannot be prevented or corrected. c. The dog is to NEVER bark when you open door or let somone in. d. NEVER pet the dog to divert it from unecessary barking 4. If your dog has an aggression problem, get INPERSON PROFESSIONAL help. Failure to observe all of the above is irresponsible and gives breed specific laws fuel, which in turn makes insurance difficult. If your jurisdiction passes a breed specific law, it will be difficult for owners of that breed to get insurance. This is why breed specific laws need to be fought whenever they are proposed.   One of the best way to fight repressive laws and insurance problems is to promote resonsible pet ownership. All of this nonsense is coming about via irresponsible pet ownership Bob Maida Dog Training/Problem Counseling Manassas,Va

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That was the topic under risk management in this months newsletter from my insurance agent! This is a serious subject and even scarier IMO than some of the dog laws as this reflects policies against which we have little to no power to resolve as far as I know. Here is the article for you to read – I do not promote any of the stated ‘facts’ as truth I am just presenting it for you to think about and see if any one has any ideas of remedies for this kind of stuff. Begin Quote:   Maybe 1995 was the year of the dog in the United States. Insurance companies paid out a record $1 billion dollars in dog bite liability claims. The Insurance Information Institute estimates 3.5 million dog bites that year alone.   Historically, in the United States an owner did not become liable for dog bites unless the dog showed a propensity to bite; in effect, a dog was entitled to a first bite. Those days are gone forever. Currently, 31 states have strict liability laws making the owner responsible for dog bites — period. In other states, it is still unlikely that a first bite will be free.    The frequency of dog bite claims has caused insurance companies to be more careful in insuring households that include a dog; however, some insurer’s Homeowners policies (including Renters policies) will cover a bite if the insurers are assured ahead of time that the dog’s breed is "docile" (a controversial subject). It is doubtful that the  insurance company will want to stay with a dog owner for subsequent bites. The Institute warns that guard dogs have proved to be less reliable than an alarm system.    Dogs should be spayed or neutered, since dogs that have not undergone these treatments are three times more likely to bite. Also, fetch is a more sociable game for dogs than tug-of-war tussles. Teach your dog to be calm around people, taking extra care when your dog is faced with an unusual situation. End Quote

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